Introduction:
In the journey of life, we often find ourselves facing uncertainty and moments where we must let go of control. In the eight episode of the Endless Possibilities Podcast, hosts Eva Muller and Gareth Duignam explore "The Path of Surrender." This episode offers profound insights into surrendering, finding guidance, and integrating spirituality into our daily lives. Join me as we delve deeper into the key takeaways from this enlightening discussion.
1. The Transition: From Control to Surrender:
The episode begins with the speaker reflecting on their transition from a known routine to uncharted territory. The speaker admits feeling both excitement and fear when venturing into a space where existing concepts and guidance are lacking. This sentiment resonates with many of us, as stepping into the unknown can be both exhilarating and daunting.
2. Connecting to Intuition and Higher Guidance:
The speaker emphasizes the importance of following impulses from various sources, including people, ideas, and books, coupled with intuition. This connection becomes a guiding force as we traverse our unique paths. The speaker's account highlights the power of intuition in guiding us towards what serves our highest good.
3. Devotion and Connecting with a Higher Power:
During a challenging period, the speaker sought help but couldn't find any solutions. It was then that a friend suggested placing their trust in someone they genuinely believed in. The speaker describes developing a deep connection with Mother Meera, a spiritual guide. Through practicing Mother Meera's meditations and establishing a relationship with Mother Meera, the speaker found solace and strength to confront their fears and anxieties. This inspiring tale underscores the transformative power of devotion and connecting with a higher power.
4. Lessons of Surrender and Intervention:
One thought-provoking lucid dream shared by the speaker highlights the consequences of intervening in someone else's journey. By rescuing a calf and returning it to what they believed was a safe field, the speaker later discovered that it was, in fact, a slaughterhouse. This serves as a powerful reminder that sometimes, we must allow others to go through their lessons without intervening, trusting that their experiences serve a higher purpose.
5. Surrender as a Gateway to Transformation:
The speaker explores the concept of surrender, inspired by Lorn Hoff's audiobooks. Surrendering involves letting go of expectations and desires, opening oneself up to everything that comes without resistance. This practice creates an open and receptive state, paving the way for personal transformation.
6. Integrating Spirituality into Daily Life:
Living in modern times presents us with a unique opportunity to integrate spirituality into our everyday experiences. The speaker emphasizes the importance of manifesting our spiritual practices into our daily lives, rather than treating them as separate entities. By practicing parallel integration, we can experience the fruits of our spiritual practices in relationships, work, and all areas of life.
7. The Power of Meditation and Transmission:
The speaker recommends incorporating meditation into our daily routines, suggesting the use of a transmission for more advanced practitioners. Meditating with a transmission offers various benefits, including heightened awareness, relaxation of the body, and reduced stress. They express doubts about the effectiveness of meditating alone, highlighting the potential for accelerated transformation through the power of a transmission.
8. Overcoming Fear and Letting Go:
Embarking on a spiritual journey often instills fear of losing familiar aspects of our lives. However, the speaker assures us that during spiritual awakening, if something is not meant to be, it will naturally fall away, making room for what aligns with our highest good. Overcoming fear is essential to enter a state of surrender and allow transformation to unfold.
Conclusion:
"The Path of Surrender" podcast episode offers valuable insights into embracing change, finding guidance, and integrating spirituality into our daily lives. By learning to surrender and let go of control, we open ourselves up to personal transformation and discover the endless possibilities life has to offer. Let us remember that surrender is not a sign of weakness, but an act of trust in the universe and ourselves. As we walk the path of surrender, may we find growth, peace, and a deeper connection to our true selves.
Full Transcript of Endless Possibilities Podcast - Episode 8 The Path of Surrender
Gareth:
Hello and welcome to the Endless Possibilities podcast. My name is Garrett and this is episode eight. And I'm here today with my good friend and co host, Eva.
Gareth:
Hello, Eva.
Eva:
Hi, Garrett.
Eva:
Hello, everybody. Welcome to the 8th episode of our podcast. Today we have a really, really interesting topic. It's about surrender. And surrender is such a big deal on the path of spiritual awakening and in general of experiencing a nice life, having life flowing through you, having a nice life experience. So that's why we decided to pick this topic today.
Gareth:
It's one that a lot of people ask about. They don't understand surrender. In my Zoom groups, I'll have people ask, can you tell me what surrender is?
Gareth:
And I guess you can't understand surrender intellectually.
Gareth:
I guess it's something that naturally comes. So we're going to talk about surrender.
Gareth:
As a path, a spiritual path.
Gareth:
It's one of three different paths that you can approach. One is surrender, one is.
Gareth:
The Yogic path.
Gareth:
It's the path of your self will. And then the other one is the.
Gareth:
Path of it's not devotion.
Gareth:
And the path of service.
Gareth:
So, Eva, is there anything you would like to start with today on the path of surrender?
Eva:
Yeah, I guess there are all these.
Eva:
Different paths, but we can use whatever we need from every path for our own path. So it's not that we need to follow one strictly, and that's it.
Eva:
I mean, you and me and a.
Eva:
Lot of people we work with, they just like to pick whatever is needed at the moment. But surrender is a really big one, and it's so helpful. And like you said, there are a lot of misunderstandings about surrender. A lot of people think surrender means.
Eva:
Not doing anything, not doing anything at all, not taking any action, not taking.
Eva:
Any action, but surrender. So I'm just going to say what I see what surrender is. Surrender is about having an open system, saying yes to whatever is happening in.
Eva:
Your life or being open towards whatever.
Eva:
Is happening and not resisting it. And that doesn't mean that you're maybe very happy with the content. It's more like, okay, I see what's coming, I see what's there. I'm okay with it, and I go from there and I change it or whatever. But with an open system and with this openness, life can just basically flow through you. So when there is no resistance, life can flow through you.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
So that's my very basic description of.
Gareth:
Surrender, and that was very good.
Gareth:
Eva okay. As a path, we're not stuck on any one path. It's not like we choose the path of surrender, and that's what we have to stay on. We can use all tree paths. We can do whatever needs to.
Gareth:
Basically, as life arises, we can change the paths.
Eva:
Yeah, but surrender is like, okay, maybe it's a path, but it's just a way of living as well, like a way of understanding how life works. And when you're on the spiritual path, it's all about giving away what's not of the highest truth, what is not of the highest truth, and just giving it away. And that means surrendering to a higher truth, allowing a higher truth to come in, and that means letting go of things that don't serve you, that are in the way.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
So just letting go of everything. And these things will go. If they are not of the highest truth or if they don't resonate basically with your beingness, then they will just fall away anyways. And allowing this, for example, is also surrendering. The first time I really started to understand surrender was when I had my shift into Unity, just before that. So I was doing sessions with you and I kind of had the LoC rising quite always in the same kind of numbers. Yeah. But then in the end, just before the Unity shift, there was like a time above about two months where nothing happened and I didn't know why.
Gareth:
What was that, Eva? Your LoC role, was it like 990 and this happens, right? I've seen this happen with a number of other people as well. Okay.
Eva:
Yeah. And then I didn't know why. And then you were like, okay, I just need to surrender, Eva. That's what you said. I just need to surrender everything. And then at the time, I was listening to Lauren hoff his audiobooks, and he talks about surrender a lot and about surrender into the being, into the self. And that's when I kind of started to understand what it means. It's about letting go. It's about opening the system, allowing everything, even though going on with your day, going on with your job, meeting people, doing everything, but just with this openness, no expectation, you don't want anything. You don't want any outcome. It's just allowing, allowing, allowing. And the more you allow, the more open the system is. And that means the more surrender is there as well. And I just surrendered. And when things arose during the day, I was like, okay, I surrendered to the Divine Mother. I surrendered. That's what I did. I always gave it to the Divine Mother. I surrendered. Surrendered.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
And eventually shifted.
Gareth:
Eva, just for people listening, when you say surrender it to the Divine Mother, exactly. What do you mean? Because.
Gareth:
What I want to get out.
Gareth:
Of this podcast is that people understand what we're talking about when we're bringing up surrender. So for you to say that you're handing it over to the Divine Mother, explain what that is.
Eva:
Yeah. So it's basically just giving something away to a higher power and not claiming.
Eva:
It back because, you know, it's been.
Eva:
Taken care of, or like Mother Mira.
Gareth:
Says, for the outcome of the yeah, yeah.
Eva:
Or anything like, if you have, like, let's say you have some scars arising or low vibrational emotions arising, you give it away. You have desires arising, you have whatever, or you're in a situation that you're not happy with and so on.
Eva:
Just like Madame Mira says, she puts.
Eva:
It that way, give it away as if it is a present because the Divine Mother doesn't care about the content. It's all about the act of giving and not claiming it back. And I really like, yeah, and then it just means you free yourself of that, basically. And if there is something else, then you are something higher. It's just easier to give it away because you have the feeling, okay, you're being taken care of. So it's a very good way to do that. That's what I did.
Eva:
And yeah, it worked.
Gareth:
Okay.
Gareth:
Surrender, it seems to come more naturally.
Gareth:
To people or individuals when they've advanced a little bit further on the spiritual path. Surrender wasn't in it just wasn't in.
Gareth:
My vocabulary early on.
Gareth:
It was me doing self will practices, me sitting and meditating every day, me finding fears, working on them, advancing my.
Gareth:
Being all the time.
Gareth:
And I didn't understand surrender. It wasn't something living in the west that a Western person is comfortable with.
Gareth:
It is, I have to do things.
Gareth:
I have to achieve things. I have to go out and make a difference, make a change, and that's all on me. And surrender was the complete opposite of this. And surrender didn't happen for me until.
Gareth:
I had woken up to a certain.
Gareth:
Extent, and just by what you said as well, it didn't happen for you until you reach unity consciousness.
Eva:
Yeah, because before we live in the concept or with the understanding we are responsible for our life's outcome or for how our life is happening to us.
Eva:
To us in that kind of way.
Eva:
So, yeah, I mean, that's what we learn from school, parents and so on, society. We are responsible for our actions. I mean, we are, but in a broader perspective, it's not that life is living is happening through us.
Gareth:
We have to achieve.
Eva:
Yeah, we have to achieve.
Gareth:
Exactly.
Gareth:
Strive. And if we don't, somebody else is going to take our place, somebody else is going to get our job or that promotion. This is the complete opposite of what surrender is.
Gareth:
When we hear of the word surrender.
Gareth:
It'S quite scary to a lot of people. It's like, whoa, how can I surrender? What if I lose my job? What if I lose my house? What if I lose my relationship? How will I be without these things?
Eva:
Because the mind doesn't understand it. And that's the thing. The mind, okay, if I surrender, I'm not in charge or in control, I'm not doing it. And then there is nothing. That's what people think, everything just stops or I don't know. But yeah, people think everything just stops, but it's not like that because if you stop still, something else would come anyways. But that's just how the mind works.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
So, yeah, it's hard. In the beginning, I also didn't understand what surrender means at all. I also thought I should stop doing everything. I was exactly the same.
Gareth:
Yeah.
Gareth:
Okay, so let's talk about surrender. Okay. How does one approach surrender? How do we give up our okay, so the way I see it is that we have our own individual will. And I would say that is the will of the small self.
Gareth:
And it's like our intellect, and we.
Gareth:
Basically project that onto our outcomes.
Gareth:
We need to make change.
Gareth:
If something doesn't go our way, if something arises and it's not to our liking, we try and change that to suit our needs. Okay.
Gareth:
Instead of allowing something greater to whatever.
Gareth:
Arises, I just accepted the good, the bad, the in between. It's just an allowing of everything. And it's so difficult to go from.
Gareth:
The small self, the pushing away what.
Gareth:
It doesn't want and the pulling in what it does want, the preferences. I like this, I don't like that. That's the intellect, that's the ego having its wants and its desires met. Whereas when we hear the word surrender.
Gareth:
It'S like, oh, well, if I surrender, what if all the bad stuff comes towards me? How can I stop the bad stuff coming?
Eva:
Yeah, the bad stuff or nothing coming.
Eva:
Yeah, I mean, it's I think that's.
Eva:
Where meditation comes in. And it's a really good tool to learn surrender because you just sit there and you just like in our case, people are just sitting in the energies and they're surrendering to the energies, so they're actually not doing anything. And the energies are working in the system for the highest good. So that's already the surrender step. Yeah, that's the first step. And trusting that everything will happen for the highest good, trusting that they will be transformed in the best possible way for them. So that's already a big step of surrender. And because we talk about meditation, it's one thing to surrender and to expand the consciousness, but then it's also about surrendering the body, getting rid of the tension in the body, relaxing the body. Because the body is such a big part of surrender, because if the body has tension, you can't surrender. So the body is such a big part.
Gareth:
The body is a feedback. Right. It gives us instant feedback.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
And for example, sitting in meditation, it's always also really good to relax as much as possible, to relax into the body, to see how the body feels.
Gareth:
And just let go, where am I not surrendering?
Eva:
And this is such a great practice.
Gareth:
Yeah, and I like that as well. Eva okay, so we can't just say to somebody who comes along and starts meditating or they start a spiritual practice and we say start to surrender.
Gareth:
Right.
Gareth:
Because they have all sorts of fear in their systems, traumas in their systems. And usually what will happen is the intellect will try and understand what surrender is. And it'll be the intellect that's trying to surrender. And it may work for a little.
Gareth:
While.
Gareth:
Once that intellect starts failing us, because this is all about real surrender is about acting from the being level.
Gareth:
And not the intellect level. And it's really, really difficult to get.
Gareth:
Somebody who's just started on the spiritual path to act from the being level. They have to be working on themselves. They have to be actively meditating, sitting down, having a practice of meditation, meditating 20 minutes, 30 minutes, twice a day, working on the fear in their system, actively finding the fears, sitting with them, working on them before they can probably surrender.
Eva:
Yeah, I mean, if they sit down and they have fear from I don't know what, like dropping too deep or dissolving or I don't know. People have all sorts of fears. Yeah, of course they need to be overcome first. I mean, nothing can happen. Nothing can happen. It's really just the fears in the system. But let's say if that's gone and you can actually sit and meditate, it's such a great practice. And then taking this practice step by step out into your normal life as well, because in meditation, you're open towards what's happening, open towards the transmission is the same when you're out in life. You're open towards whatever life brings. You having this openness in the body, allowing whatever comes through. I mean, of course, in meditation, you're not acting on anything, you're just sitting. So it's basically the first step in normal life. You're just acting as well, of course, but it's like integrating. That what you do in meditation then into normal life. And also when you meditate, the ego kind of starts step in the background and also the small self gets thinned out. It's like the meditation is happening. And then you experience these changes also in normal life after a while, right when it's manifesting and then also normal life. I mean, there is no normal life. I'm just saying it so that's clear. It also starts being the experience in normal life and then you go from there.
Gareth:
So we would say that one needs to be meditating every day, like having.
Gareth:
Their own practice to start to cultivate surrender in their system because otherwise it's just too difficult. Surrender is typically a religious path, isn't it? It would be from monks and.
Eva:
You.
Gareth:
Would have people going on retreats and resigning from their jobs and sitting in meditation for hours every day.
Gareth:
Normally that's what surrender yeah.
Eva:
I guess this is why we live in such a great time, because we can just incorporate it in our everyday life. We do the surrender and we have the everyday life. And I feel like that's why people are progressing so fast, because you're manifesting this in your everyday life so quickly. You go to meditate and you manifest it so quickly because it's always about embodying it and manifesting this in your life experience what you have learned. And if you sit, I guess, in a monastery for a few years, I mean, why not? If people feel drawn to that? But in the end, it's about like, yeah, you have to come back and then you have to integrate it. And if you do this parallel, it's just so much easier. And you experience the feedback right away. And that's such a good thing. You experience the feedback in your everyday life with your friends, family, loved ones, I don't know, work colleagues. You get the feedback, the fruits of the meditation and the surrender. You experience it right away.
Eva:
Yeah.
Gareth:
And surrender would be a really fast path. Right. You're basically surrendering your will over to the greater will of the universe.
Gareth:
You're saying, I give this over to you.
Gareth:
I'll just surrender to whatever it is.
Gareth:
That you put in front of me?
Eva:
Yeah, because, I mean, in the end.
Eva:
It'S about giving up everything. Everything can stay.
Gareth:
This is terrifying for people. I can hear people now listening to this and going, I don't want that. I don't want to do that. I don't want to give that part of me over. I want to hold on to something where I'm protected, where I have money in the bank or I have an escape route in case everything goes wrong.
Eva:
Yeah, it's not about giving up life. You live your normal life still, and it's just how can I explain this better? This is something else I just want to share because this comes up a lot as well. People are scared of losing things, like on the path of spiritual awakening and what I tell them. I mean, it can happen if they have things in their lives that shouldn't be there at all. Like a totally wrong relationship. I don't know, like totally wrong job or stuff. That is not for I'm always saying for the highest good because, I mean, that's what it is in the end, for the person, then things might be falling away, but mostly you choose to let things go and it's all a process. So it's like over a few years, you might decide, okay, I want to have a different job because I don't like my old job anymore, or I want to have a different relationship or whatever. So it's mostly a choice. And if it really falls away, then.
Eva:
When you look back, probably three years.
Eva:
Later and look back, you're happy that it left. So nothing will fall away. That's really of your highest good and serves you.
Gareth:
And they don't all fall away in one chunk. We talk about people's relationships falling apart and their jobs falling apart. Generally, it doesn't all happen in one go. So it's not like a big disaster comes towards you. And these things happen over a period of time, over a course of that awakening, of going through your spiritual awakening. It's not like everything has just dropped right on top of you, right? Things just fall away naturally when you're ready for them to fall away.
Eva:
Yes, but it also means not much falls awake. This can be an option too like that hardly anything falls away. So yeah, I know some people have this fear in their system but this is a very important topic.
Eva:
To share because it's always for you anyways that they're falling away.
Gareth:
Yes. And.
Gareth:
What about.
Gareth:
This way of trying to control, of trying to prevent certain things happening of the mind, trying to project into the future and to stop certain situations from arising, to have things go the way we want it to? Because when we really start to live an authentic life and we drop into a place of surrender I mean the.
Gareth:
Things that we forecast that were in.
Gareth:
The future, the negative things when they do often arise, they're not as bad as they seem, they just turn up and we accept them in this moment.
Gareth:
It's more the mind's projection of what.
Gareth:
That could be like and how many disasters could happen or arise from that. But when we just meet everything as it arises in the present moment so I guess the render is just accepting everything in the present moment as it.
Gareth:
Is good, bad, whatever happens, we just accept it, we deal with it and.
Gareth:
We'Re not saying that we just have to be roll over and die. We still have a free will when it arises, don't we? We can still say no, this is not exactly what I want. We still have a choice that we can make. We can choose love or we can choose fear. So I wonder it's not a totally passive path either eva, is it? It's not like we do have a choice at the end of the day we still have a free will.
Eva:
Yeah, I mean, we always have a choice but then because you said surrender comes more when you're further on the path or just more aware, you will probably choose the things I mean, if you don't choose it right away, maybe then you probably choose it two months later or whatever. Because if you are on that path and you want to evolve and you want to also feel good and expand.
Eva:
It'S just there is no point.
Eva:
You really see no point in holding on to these things that are fearful or they bring you down or they don't make you feel good and often it's a habit. Safety and security is like a concept we have because it doesn't exist. We just build it with our minds and it's also like a cage. We build it, but it's not even there. I mean, energetically it's there, but it doesn't exist really. And yeah, we make ourselves small with.
Eva:
That and it's good that you said.
Eva:
Before also it's small steps because if we would be there one day without any concepts, without any things that make us small, it would be really sudden, but this is a process. So the one baby step after the other. So then we realize one concept, or we let go of this one. Then two weeks later, we realized the next one, and we let go. It's actually really slow. I mean, that things suddenly fall away. It's not like that. Yeah, it's very slow.
Eva:
And Garrett, you said for you it.
Eva:
Was also a bit later when you started to learn or to experience the surrender. Do you want to share a little bit?
Gareth:
Absolutely. I'm glad you asked, because my early.
Gareth:
Years, I was very much a.
Gareth:
What would I say? I mean, I ran a business, I was an entrepreneur, a very active life. I was into sports similar to you, Eva. It was very much like to get on in the world. I needed to work hard. I had to get up at 06:00 a.m.. Every morning. I had to get out before other people got out, and I had to outwork them. This was my motto. This was how I approached life, was that I need to work hard.
Gareth:
I need to work hard outwork everybody else, and that's how I would get on.
Gareth:
And the whole thing of surrender just it was totally alien to me. It was a really alien concept, and it didn't arise from me. So I had a spontaneous awakening that I talk about in the gym.
Gareth:
And I guess leading up to that.
Gareth:
Awakening, I had discovered Eckhart Tolle the Power of the now. And I'd been listening to his audiobooks for a few months, and this whole notion of going, oh, just accept everything. Accept everything as it is, because it just wasn't there for was. I was meditating. I had a spiritual practice, but it was very much the yogic, the path of the warrior, the warrior's path. I find a fear in my system, and then I say to myself, okay, I have that fear. What's the best way of getting rid of that fear is to go and throw myself into something that brings that fear on. Let's just say public speaking. So, okay, I don't like public speaking.
Gareth:
So I'm going to go and I'm going to public speak.
Gareth:
And that was the way I was removing the fears out of my system. And it worked. That really worked well for me up until a certain point. And then from that point on, when I awoken, when I had that awakening and I woke up or the self woke up to the reality of itself in me, fear just fell away. So it was like then all of.
Gareth:
A sudden, it was a lot easier.
Gareth:
For me to surrender.
Gareth:
It was like, well, hang on, if.
Gareth:
I just surrender, it's like, I know what I am, and what I am was never born, it never dies. This is just a game, and I can just do what I want in the game, and I can just surrender and let something greater than me look after everything. My business, for instance. I had a business for 15 years. I had multiple people working for me, family, friends.
Gareth:
And I had put so much work.
Gareth:
And effort into it. I mean, like blood, sweat and tears, hours. I couldn't even go on a holiday. If I went on a holiday, I'd have to bring my computer. And I would sit there every day, logged into the computers back in the store, printing labels. I could never enjoy life when I had this business. Yes, it brought in a nice income, and I had a certain amount of freedom where if I wanted it, I could leave early.
Eva:
But.
Gareth:
It was just me constantly striving.
Gareth:
To get on in life.
Gareth:
So as I woke up, I watched that business start to fall apart. And I knew that it was falling apart. I knew what was happening. I knew that it was falling apart so something greater could come in.
Gareth:
But it was still quite difficult.
Gareth:
There were still times when I go, god, I'd look at the beautiful store I had. I had these two amazing stores that.
Gareth:
They just looked amazing.
Gareth:
I'd put so much work into them, and one of them went I was like, oh, I just didn't want to watch it go.
Eva:
Can I just ask you something? When you say it was falling apart, do you want to describe it just a little bit better? Because so that people understand. Did no customers come in anymore? Did you just see, okay, you don't put any energy into it anymore. That's why stuff is not happening anymore.
Eva:
How did it fall apart?
Gareth:
Okay, so it wasn't that I wasn't working hard anymore.
Gareth:
I had resigned to the idea that.
Gareth:
Something else was going to come in. I had a vision one Saturday evening where I was told that my real work wasn't the work that I was doing. I was like, oh, I spoke about this more. I won't get into it now. But I was told that my real.
Gareth:
Work was something else.
Gareth:
But I still had put so much.
Gareth:
I was like, well, 15 years of.
Gareth:
My life has gone into this. So over the next two years and it wasn't like I just went, oh, I know that I have another something else coming in.
Gareth:
I'm just going to not do anything anymore.
Gareth:
I still turned up every day. I still did the best that I was supposed to do in my job because I was an entrepreneur. I ran a business, and that's what I just did. I still turned up every day. I still ran my business the way I always ran it. But there was external factors that started.
Gareth:
To come in that I had no control over.
Gareth:
Big multinational companies came in. They started undercutting us. There was all sorts of things. I get to the very end, basically, our profit margins just got lower and lower and lower. I couldn't shift fast enough. I had these really expensive high rents, and I couldn't get out of them. I had these leases that were, like.
Gareth:
Five years left on them, so.
Eva:
I.
Gareth:
Couldn'T do what I wanted to do in order to save my company. So I had to sit there and.
Gareth:
Watch my profits that were in the.
Gareth:
Business disappear and get smaller and smaller each year. I think by the end of the third year, I'd lost €180,000.
Gareth:
I'd just watched disappear out out of of the company.
Gareth:
And eventually, there was three stores, two of them closed. I was in the last store, and.
Gareth:
I was going through this awakening at.
Gareth:
The time, and I was just coming in every I was driving in every morning, and I was just going in one way. It was like, okay, the company's falling.
Gareth:
Apart, but I didn't care.
Gareth:
It was like I was watching it fall apart, but I was like, yeah, I drive in. I'd had these most these really beautiful drives, but an hour into work every morning, I'd be experiencing bliss. I was going through surrender at this time because I had woken up, and there wasn't very much fear in my system. So eventually, the landlord came, and he said my lease was up. I had a five year lease, and he put the rent up €20,000 on me. And, I mean, at this stage, I was losing money year after year after year, and I was like, he's made my decision. And in the same week that the landlord put my rent up, I said, okay, that's it. I'm done.
Gareth:
My website got hacked, and.
Gareth:
I came home. When I even opened up the computer to look at sales, there was a message on my login saying, we have taken over your website. You have to pay us €10,000 for.
Gareth:
Us to give it back to you. And I was like, that's it.
Gareth:
That's the universe. It's made the decision for me, and I just had to surrender to that. So it was like, right, let's do it. While that was going on, I had.
Gareth:
Been starting my zoom meditations, so it.
Gareth:
Wasn'T a smooth transition into what I was doing. Lots of people were saying to me, oh, well, why don't you do one to one sessions, Gar? Why don't you do retreats or whatever? So it was like, oh, okay. It sounds like a good idea. We'll try it. I set in my mind, I have a mortgage. I have bills. I need a certain amount of money. And, I mean, when I started, I was, like, doing two or three one to one sessions a week.
Gareth:
It was like I was basically going.
Gareth:
Okay, universe, this is up to you. If you want me to do this work, you bring in the money. So I was just sat there. I wouldn't say fearful, but I needed the universe to back me up on this, and it was trusting that it was. Going to and it did, literally. As the business closed, I still had.
Gareth:
Stock that I had.
Gareth:
I was kind of selling that stock off as the shops were closing. So I had some money, I was able to pay the bills. And I kind of slowly watched myself transition into this role of what I'm doing now, where I was working with people.
Gareth:
And then after six months, everything just opened up.
Gareth:
I had a website. My one to one sessions started to build up. And again, none of it was perfect. None of it was like in the.
Gareth:
Early days, I did everything by donation.
Gareth:
Eva it was like, okay, this is the path of surrender. I'm going to surrender all this over and I'm going to do my sessions on a donation base where people do a session and then they give me what they feel the session was worth. So that was me really thrown myself into surrender.
Eva:
Yeah, I mean, fully, fully. And it's interesting because before, when you had your business, it's like you knew what you're up for, you knew what your daily routine is, you knew what you order. Blah, blah, everything is known. But then you entered an area where there was nothing there, so you had to create it all. Which is really exciting because you can create it. But on the other hand, there's no concept or nothing there. And this is the fearful part, because you don't know what to do. But then impulses are coming right from people, from yourself, books, I don't know, ideas. And so intuition. Exactly. And then you just start going with that. But, yeah, I mean, that's a perfect example of going from control into control.
Gareth:
Eva I was very good at what I did. A big part of what I'd done was like, it was e commerce and retail, and I would import products, and I was really good at sourcing things and shipping them into certain areas.
Gareth:
And I was what you would call ruthless in business.
Gareth:
I would do whatever I needed to do to progress. And then all of a sudden, everything just changed. All of a sudden it was like, oh, that part of me just fell away. And I watched myself I watched that part die. Usually I'd be able to sell sand to the Arabs, as they say. I was a salesman. People would come in, I could sell them product, I could pick up the phone, I could find stuff, whatever was needed.
Gareth:
And then all of a sudden, it was like people would come in and.
Gareth:
They'D ask for products. And I was like, I don't believe in these products anymore.
Gareth:
I don't use them.
Gareth:
And I couldn't sell them. I couldn't lie to someone anymore. I didn't have the belief. It wasn't that I was lying, I just didn't have the belief in what I was selling. Once upon a time, I did. I was a big believer of what I was selling. And then all of a sudden, it was like, no, I can't tell a lie to person. I had become vegan in the meantime, and a lot of the products I were selling were dairy based. So people would come in, they say, Is this product good? And they'd hold it up and it'd be a dairy product. And I wasn't using it, so I couldn't lie to them.
Gareth:
So I had to say, well, I.
Gareth:
Said, yeah, it's good. It'll do what it's supposed to do. I said, but look, this is what I use. And I'd pick up sun warrior vegan protein. And a lot of them would be looking at me going, that's not what I want. But that's where I was. So I had to surrender it all. I had to watch it all just fall away.
Eva:
Yeah, and that's another good example. You went vegan for reasons, right? So it's also for reasons, and then your surrounding or what you were selling started to change. It's all a process. It's not like one day to the other. You decided to change a diet now, okay, you rather sell the vegan product over the dairy product and so on. So what? It was your choice because you believed in that more. And this is also like when old things fall away that don't serve. You find new things that serve, and you believe in them and you just follow them. And that's how a path can change or something can change.
Gareth:
So I was now very much in the path of surrender. That was how most of my spiritual.
Gareth:
Progress from that point on opened up.
Gareth:
For me, was by me surrendering. I wasn't devotional, devotion. The whole love and devotion thing, it wasn't really on my path. Mine was all surrender, surrender, surrender, surrender. But that was going from the path of the warrior first to surrender. I think that early on, the path of surrender just would not have worked for me. And I wonder if can we talk.
Gareth:
About the path of surrender not working for certain people?
Gareth:
Because it's like these three paths. So you've got the path of the warrior, which is the Yogic path. You've got the path of surrender, and.
Gareth:
Then you have the path of what.
Gareth:
Did we say it was? The path of service.
Eva:
You know what? The thing is, I never looked in those paths. I don't know anything about those paths, really. I just used what naturally came up for me. I mean, I understand when you share what it is, but it's not that I read anything about it. I don't know people who just followed this one path. So I don't know.
Eva:
Are there people who it doesn't work for?
Eva:
I don't know. To be honest, I don't know because it worked for me. And I have also that understanding. I just feel like what else would work? That's the thing. I just don't have a different.
Gareth:
You didn't you didn't know about the paths.
Gareth:
But you were probably using all three.
Gareth:
Paths at some know, because I know you were very much devoted towards Mother Mira, and I know you went and.
Gareth:
You stayed in her ashram and you.
Gareth:
Did service for her, correct?
Eva:
Yes, exactly. Actually, just twice, but I did yeah, I did service. I mean, twice. Okay, if you want to talk about that.
Eva:
So when I had the unity shift.
Eva:
I had a very hard time and I didn't know what to do. Nobody could help me. I had a lot of fear, anxiety in the system. I felt energies all over it. Too many energies. I was sensitive, so I had a very hard time. And a friend of mine said, you know what? Choose somebody who you really trust and then just trust that person or whoever you choose and then go from. So on the one hand, because you were my guide, I trusted you. But then I also decided to trust Madameira because I felt I have a very deep connection to her. I was doing her meditations and seeing her a few times before, and it wasn't like it's not that I am a very devotional person, but I just understood this is what I need. I need to hold on to something because otherwise I'm just going to fall. And that's why I decided to just hold on to Mother Mira. And I basically built devotion. So it wasn't that it was in me, but I just built it like a relationship. So I was reading stuff about her, meditating with her, praying and all these things just connecting every day. And it helped so much because it's.
Eva:
Like you just surrender everything then to.
Eva:
Her, because I know she helped me when I had a question, like, answers came when I needed help. The help came when I did the meditations. I felt nurtured and looked after and stuff like that from her energy. So it was very easy then. I mean, it took some time, of.
Eva:
Course, step by step, but just giving.
Eva:
Myself to her, allowing her to guide me. So this helped me a lot to surrender, but to a higher power, to the Divine Mother. So. First to Mother Mira.
Eva:
Yeah, the I until I didn't need it anymore.
Eva:
But it was there for a while and it was really helpful. And actually, I share that with a lot of people who I work with because praying and giving stuff away to a higher power, and people can choose who they want, like God, Divine Mother, the universe, it's just giving it away to something higher than you are until you know you are that anyways.
Gareth:
Yes.
Eva:
Until then, you need the connection. And it's also about putting the focus on something higher because before you put the focus on the fear. And how am I supposed to do that? I don't know what's going to happen in the future. I don't know how to handle this and I don't know. Of course you don't.
Gareth:
You're bombarded with lots and lots of decisions. It's like, how can I handle all of these decisions, where in surrender, you just hand it over to something. It's like, so easy. I just hand it over to the Divine Mother or God or the universe.
Eva:
Yeah, exactly. And you're free and you just go on with your day.
Eva:
Yeah.
Gareth:
So it's the most simple. It really is the most simple, and it's the fastest way.
Gareth:
Whereas before, it's like, oh, I have.
Gareth:
To do this and I have to do that, and I have to control this and all of these different things. Whereas surrender, you're just going, I'll just let it be. I'll just let it be in the hands of the universe.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
And then she has such a beautiful saying. I only have the German one in my mind, so I tried to because I have it on my nightstand still. But this helped me so much. It's about everything that happens to you. So it's a saying of Madameira, everything that happens to you happens because of the love of the Divine Mother. Does that make sense in and then I also knew, okay, if things are happening that I'm not so happy with, there is a reason for that. So this was also like surrendering to the let's say more negative things or the things I didn't prefer. Yeah.
Gareth:
So the saying that you just said there, Eva, would translate into everything that's happening to you is the will of the Divine Mother.
Gareth:
Is that what you're saying? So everything that's happening is the will.
Gareth:
Of the Divine Mother, the good and the bad.
Eva:
Yes. But for you, like, in a way.
Gareth:
For you for you to grow.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
She's doing everything because she loves you.
Eva:
That's what they're saying.
Gareth:
So you're not a victim. It's that you've been taught lessons and that you have to accept them as if you ask for them. This is how I would perceive real surrender, is that whatever arises.
Gareth:
You accept it. Like you ask for it.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
I mean, that's a way because it's.
Gareth:
For your highest good.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
But it's again, staying open, saying yes.
Eva:
To that because it's there for a.
Eva:
Reason, and it's there to help you.
Eva:
To transform towards the highest truth, your.
Eva:
Highest good, to transform, to expand spiritually. So it's always for you anyways.
Gareth:
Okay.
Gareth:
And then, Eva, let's just talk about how surrender becomes just naturally part of us. It's like, in the beginning, we're trying to surrender. We're surrendering everything over. We're actively going, okay, I need to surrender this, I need to surrender that. So we're actively trying to surrender our intellect and our will. We're saying, okay, something greater. You take over, you look after us.
Gareth:
I'll just allow everything to be but.
Gareth:
Then at a certain stage, you're acting just from being. You are that being level. And it's like as if you're allowing life just to be. And I talk about this. For me, my personal experience is that.
Gareth:
I generally don't get involved in pretty.
Gareth:
Much anything that's going on in the outside world. I just allow people might ask me to do this or to do that, or try allow I just say, look, everything is absolutely perfect as it is. I generally don't like to get involved. So I wonder, could we talk about that eva?
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
So it's not interfering with not interfering.
Gareth:
To you just quickly. I generally tend not to I won't cause harm. I won't eat meat. I'll try not to disturb my surroundings, nature. I'll never cause harm to an animal or an insect.
Gareth:
But I also allow everything to be.
Gareth:
Exactly as it should be. I don't go getting involved if I see a bee that goes into water or something like that. I don't rush over trying to save the bee. I allow everything just to be as it is. I wonder, can we talk about that a little bit?
Eva:
Yeah, I mean, everything is perfect as it is.
Eva:
I guess. Today surrender is something that's just there.
Eva:
And it can't not be there. It's there all the time. The system is open. There is nobody who would interfere. Yeah, that's just the natural state. What's the question exactly?
Eva:
When it started to come in more, you mean?
Gareth:
Yeah, when it's there just naturally for you?
Eva:
Yeah, I mean, I think really 100% there all the time. It was with the Brahmin shift, like it wasn't there before. Okay, interesting.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
Before it's like it was there a lot. Let's just say, I don't know, 70, 80% maybe or something.
Gareth:
I would agree.
Eva:
And it gets less and less so less and less interference, less and less not being okay, what's there? And surrendering more and more. And it's just the energies help so much. So first, okay, it's your realizations, the level of consciousness. But also when you meditate to these energies, the energies, they carry you also in a way, they help you to get over these things, not to interfere, not to create new Karma. There was a time when I realized, okay, I'm not creating Karma anymore.
Gareth:
Yeah, me too.
Gareth:
And that was after Brahman. That was the Brahman I knew that there was no Karma. Now, being produced by my.
Eva:
Was it was late, a very integrated unity phase. And then fully in brahman. And in Brahman, it's just like I mean, there are also deeper or more depth to Brahman over time, of course, because it never stops refined perceptions. But yeah, if there are no desires.
Eva:
For nothing in this world, in this.
Eva:
Life, you wouldn't interfere with anything. You wouldn't want to change anything.
Eva:
Everything is just how it is.
Gareth:
And your inside world, your inside reality.
Gareth:
Is so for me, okay, my inner.
Gareth:
World is so much more richer than my outside world. So it's like, oh, it's like, why would I want to get involved in anything that's going on outside.
Gareth:
It's like I just sit here and.
Gareth:
I'm just like, everything is so rich, everything is so vibrant. I just close my eyes and it's just like, wow.
Gareth:
And it's like, why do I want.
Gareth:
To cause ripples on my outside world?
Gareth:
Why do I want to again, I'm.
Gareth:
Not going to flog a dead horse.
Gareth:
But me trying to go out and.
Gareth:
Actively help not help or heal, but getting my will, trying to take away someone else's lesson, it just causes ripples of karma.
Gareth:
So it's like, okay, yes, I could.
Gareth:
Go and get involved in that situation.
Gareth:
And then do you understand what I'm saying?
Gareth:
Yes. It's like there's a whole other set of consequences that will come from doing that.
Gareth:
Whereas when you're just resting in your.
Gareth:
Own brilliance and stillness yeah, but I.
Gareth:
Don'T want to do any of that.
Eva:
Yeah, but the question is not even there. Do you want to do it? Because it's just not happening. There is no energy behind it. There is no energy behind it.
Eva:
So before there's the energy again, I.
Eva:
Want to help, I want to do something, I want to change the world.
Gareth:
I want to say that that's bad. We're not saying that to do them things is bad. They're really good things to do on a high scale of what a human should be is to go out and help other people. So we're not saying that them things are bad. We're just saying that as you progress and as you awaken fully, you start to retreat more into your own inner world and you just let everything be as it is.
Eva:
Exactly.
Eva:
Yeah, exactly. So you don't want to change things and you don't judge things. That's the thing. So it's not good or bad, it's like you don't judge, you let it be. Yeah, let it be. That's maybe the best word to describe.
Gareth:
And another difficult one for some people, will be someone suffering.
Gareth:
It's like, oh, that person on the.
Gareth:
Outside, they look like they're suffering and I should be able to help them or I should be able to ease that suffering in some way.
Gareth:
And sometimes that person that suffering is.
Gareth:
Part of their journey. That's part of their lesson is to go through that. And by us getting involved, we're taking away that lesson. And again, this comes back to one of the lucid dreams that I had that time where I seen that the calf that had escaped from the field, I thought, oh, it's escaped, I better go over, it might be getting to danger. And I picked it up and I put it back over the fence and thought I had done a good deed. And I walked down the road and I got around the corner and this man said to me, he goes, oh. He said, I see you put the calf back into the into the field. And I said, yeah, big smile on my face and he pointed up and I looked and it was the slaughterhouse.
Eva:
Slaughterhouse. Yeah.
Gareth:
I had put the calf back in. And that was early on when I realized that, oh, my actions, they have consequences.
Eva:
Yes, definitely.
Eva:
I really like that Lucy dream. That's a really good lesson. It's a tricky one to talk about because people might get it wrong. That's the problem. Or might misunderstand, because it has nothing to do with being heartless or not wanting to help, because you would help anyways. But it's like the energy behind it, the drive, is just all gone.
Gareth:
Not that you're cold and insensitive.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
No.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
It's hard to talk about this.
Gareth:
It's very difficult for people who haven't got to that stage to understand what we're talking about. Eva it's really difficult.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
It's like the inside world is so dominant that you don't really look at the outside world is hardly like from the percentage, maybe 20% of how I experience life is. I experience the outside world. If you want to say that there is an outside, it's not relevant.
Eva:
It feels like a dream.
Gareth:
It feels like a fading dream. It's happening and you can engage in it, but it's a fading dream that's constantly just fleeting. Everything is just fleeting. Everything is arising and disappearing. And the importance of certain situations, they just lose that. It's just not as important as you used to see it.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
And this planet is the planet Earth, where beings are incarnating and they're here to learn, to evolve, to grow, to eventually then go back to God.
Eva:
So that's like.
Eva:
An area where this is happening.
Eva:
And when you see this that it's.
Eva:
Really like that not just intellectually, but you just know, then it's perfect. Like the God's plan or everything that's happening here. It's a perfect play of consciousness. It's perfectly playing out. Everybody's doing whatever they need to do. There is no judgment. Everything is happening. There is no interference needed. Only if you get the impulse to interfere, because that's when you are basically being pushed, let's say it like that. Or you're being called to interfere, otherwise you're not. Yeah.
Gareth:
So your awareness yourself is the witness.
Gareth:
Of all experience and it doesn't get involved. It just allows everything to be that's.
Gareth:
The self, the awareness. It's just life is happening and the awareness is the watcher.
Gareth:
And then you have a being part that has free will, so it can get involved or it can decide not to get involved.
Gareth:
So it's like, all of this is.
Gareth:
Happening and even God's will is not to interfere. It just allows everything to be.
Gareth:
God doesn't get involved, it just watches.
Gareth:
It just sees everything as it is and allows everything to be.
Gareth:
And the further along the path you.
Gareth:
Go, the more like God you become. You allow everything just to unfold exactly the way it's supposed to without you getting involved.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
Because everything is perfect as it is perfect. And this is not just the intellectual understanding. This is like in every cell of the body, the information is just there. So you just know it's like the experience.
Gareth:
Yeah, because the human mind goes, there's a spot of nature. I know what go great, there a park and maybe a set of swings and a shop. And this is what the mind does.
Gareth:
Whereas awareness just allows everything to be it's like everything is just perfect the way it is.
Eva:
Like on my balcony, there are a lot of plants growing, and they shouldn't be growing there.
Gareth:
We call them weeds.
Eva:
So when I look outside, my mother in law, she also looks from another window and she doesn't like it at all because she's very tidy and she likes me to remove them. But there is no energy for that because I just let it be.
Gareth:
Exactly. Exactly. And that's my attitude as well. There's a lot of stuff that's not in view of the camera there. I just allow everything to be as it is. Whereas other people would say, gareth, that room is a mess.
Eva:
Yeah.
Eva:
And it's not in the know, that's the thing. It's not in the way it's just you recognize it and that's it. So it's basically very freeing and it's freedom. It's pure freedom. But just to go back to before so people who are realizing, okay, I have the ability to surrender, or this is actually something I can do.
Eva:
So just to sum it up, so.
Eva:
There are two different good things, which is shared, it's meditating and then it's also devotion would be a good option if somebody feels drawn to that.
Gareth:
I'm afraid devotion, it's not my thing. So it's not something I talk about an awful lot because it just didn't come up for me during my awakening.
Eva:
Yeah, but I know people who are actually really devotional. So I would say I was like, I needed it for a while and it really helped. But I know people who are like that from the heart. I mean, that's very beautiful. It's a very beautiful path because you're like in love with you feel the love for the Divine Mother or the Avatar. You choose. I have somebody in mind.
Gareth:
Well, I'm laughing because I remember years ago I won't say what intensive, but.
Gareth:
I was at an intensive and there.
Gareth:
Was a guy crying and I remember looking and he had tears rolling down his face and there was a puddle in front of him. And at the end of the he jumped up and he put his head and his hands down at the guru's feet and the guru kicked him in the head to get him away. He was like, Get away. So his devotion was sort of like it wasn't.
Eva:
Know, like to choose AMA or Madamero or somebody like or you can also choose not a person as the Divine Mother, but the Deity. What's the word? The deity, or even just the energy, like everything that is the presence of the Divine Mother. Everybody can choose whatever.
Gareth:
You can choose whatever feels good.
Eva:
Exactly.
Gareth:
If it's the Virgin Mary or if it's one of the Hindu goddesses or.
Eva:
Yeah, for example, the Hindu gods never resonated with me. For you. They did, for example. So then everybody is really different.
Gareth:
They serve a purpose and they can arise and you can have a connection with them. But again, it's just something that you'll drop after a certain time.
Eva:
Yeah. I mean, maybe not because people don't.
Eva:
Know, but we can share it's there for a reason for a while, and it's really good. So a lot of things are really good. The concepts so concepts are very helpful, and it's always good to replace the one that's not serving anymore with a new one, but then eventually they will fall also away. Eventually there are no concepts, but it's important to have them on the way.
Gareth:
Yeah. So going back to the path of surrender. So things that we can do is.
Gareth:
Definitely meditation practice, maybe twice a day.
Gareth:
20 minutes, half an hour. Build it up over time.
Eva:
Yeah, just for beginners. But if you are more advanced, of course, like at least an hour. And really, I mean, I recommend because I just see how that it works, meditate with a transmission. Because I also have people in my sessions who just meditate by themselves, and they ask me, okay, is this also helpful? And I said, yes, to get more awareness, to just relax the body more, to quiet the system, to get away from stress and stuff like that. I guess it's very helpful. But being in a transmission, meditating with a transmission, it's like the transmission will help you that the energy in a transmission will help you with the transformation. So it will just happen really quickly compared to just sitting by yourself. I don't really think you can really get anywhere by just sitting by yourself.
Eva:
You need grace, in a way.
Eva:
So, yeah, grace definitely a transmission is something that really helps. And I would recommend sitting with a transmission at least an hour a day.
Eva:
Yeah, so that's really good.
Eva:
And then also because there are also good books out there, and I just want to recommend one book, which I listened to the audiobook and really, really liked it. It was from Mike, our singer. The Surrender Experiment. And just very briefly, it's about a guy, and he just decided, okay, I surrender. I surrender to everything that happens in my life. And then he wrote a book about it and about his life, and it's actually really interesting. It's also entertaining in a way. But I learned so much in such a good book, so I can recommend this one if somebody wants to have just an additional for understanding and yeah, it's a very helpful one.
Gareth:
Yeah.
Gareth:
And I guess as well that life.
Gareth:
Can make you surrender as well.
Gareth:
One of the things life, if you.
Gareth:
Don'T bend to life, you're going to break. So it's like life is the force that's coming true, and it's up to you to surrender to what's happening.
Gareth:
Otherwise you break.
Eva:
Yeah, I mean, life will just break.
Gareth:
You constantly in resistance to what's happening. It will break you. It will absolutely break you. So, yeah, I think we've covered some amazing topics today. Eva.
Gareth:
Anything else before we go?
Eva:
I think this is one of the most important topics on the spiritual path. Yeah, and it's such a beautiful topic as well, and it brings you so much value in a beautiful way. If you allow surrender in your life, so many nice things can happen. You meet nice people, like miracles, whatever you want to call it can happen. I mean, they can happen all the time anyways, but just by having this openness and if there is no resistance or at least less resistance to life, life experience is also so much nicer, and also you advance on the spiritual path also so much faster.
Eva:
So it's such a great tool or yes.
Eva:
Way of living.
Gareth:
Amazing.
Eva:
That's the end.
Gareth:
I guess we'll revisit this in a future episode. Maybe we can talk about some of the other paths. But I think today was really amazing. And next week so, episode nine, we're going to have another guest on the show.
Eva:
Yeah.
Gareth:
So I'm looking forward to that really interesting one for next week. So any topics? Anything you want to just finish up on? Any little pointers?
Eva:
I was just doing my ending before, just before.
Gareth:
You've done really well as the commentator with the microphone today, Eva, congratulations. You can go off now and commentate on a football match.
Eva:
Yeah. Garrett was like, I look like Destiny's Child, but I just thought I want to have a nicer sound.
Gareth:
You sounded great. We both upped our game this week by investing in expensive microphones and audio equipment.
Eva:
Still not the best, but I'm on it. One day, I will have the perfect sound. It yours is really good. So great.
Gareth:
I know it cool.
Eva:
Cool. All right.
Eva:
Okay, thank you, everybody, for listening.
Eva:
It was great. Great talking to you, Garrett, and see you next time.
Gareth:
Okay, thank you, guys. Bye.
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